I was watching the NRL Grand Final with the lads on Sunday. Cracker of a game. Afterwards, we flicked over to the Singapore Grand Prix. Boring as batshit. So we started talking cars. Out of five of us, three had Teslas – me included. The other two owners love their cars. Cheap to run, great drive, no servicing. But both said they wouldn’t buy another. One reason: Elon’s turned into an arsehole.
That’s sad, and here’s why. I got Tesla’s Supervised Full Self Driving (FSD) three weeks ago. Paid full freight, I’m no Tesla influencer. I was sceptical until I drove it. SolarQuotes blogger Ronald Brakels summed it up after trying mine:
“I am at IKEA. Alive! Tense at first, but it handled itself. Safe when cut off, calm behind a bus. Weird how quickly you relax.”
Full Self Driving Is Nearly Here
The cheerful rainbow colour scheme representing Tesla’s self driving mode unfortunately did not make Ronald feel any more relaxed.
My experience: it is 99% there. Most drives feel relaxing and safe with zero interventions. Whether Tesla will ever nail the final 1% to make it Non-Supervised Full Self Driving is an open question. But I’m grateful someone’s trying.
As a parent and a cyclist, I’d rather share the road with the current build of FSD than a human. It’s better than most Adelaide drivers. Not once did it risk a cyclist’s life to get to a red light 3 seconds early. This thing can save millions of lives.
Stalled By Emotion
Yet many people won’t buy Teslas because of emotion. That’s Marketing 101: we buy with emotion, not logic. And fewer FSD-capable cars means less safety for everyone.
The same emotions stall other parts of electrification. Some won’t buy panels from the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). Others won’t join a Virtual Power Plant (VPP) because they hate big energy. And yes, SolarQuotes is now owned by Origin, one of those “big energy” players. But Origin isn’t the only VPP in town. There are plenty of others. The point isn’t whose logo is on the app. The point is that the spare capacity of giant home batteries sitting idle helps no one.
With average home batteries post-rebate now over 20 kWh, that’s a mountain of wasted capacity. A wasted chance to cut carbon.
The revolution will happen. The tech is too good. But it’ll drag, slowed by the messiness of humans. We’ll still end up with safer roads and a cleaner grid just later and bloodier than it had to be.
Phase Shift is a weekly opinion column by SolarQuotes founder Finn Peacock. Subscribe to SolarQuotes’ free newsletter to get it emailed to your inbox each week along with our other home electrification coverage.
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These arseholes are also responsible for doing incredible harm to people. One does not negate the other.
We do not need arseholes to have good things.
So boycott the CCP arseholes? Or some arseholes are bad arseholes, others are acceptable arseholes?
I bought Tesla shares before Elon began his journey to become the world’s biggest arseh###.
His DoE cuts to USAID – cutting hundreds of thousands of African HIV patients and malaria sufferers off their medication could potentially lead to thousands of premature deaths.
I would dearly love to have a Tesla MY-L (the stretched 3 row 6 seat available in China) with FSD if it wore another badge. I think FSD will finally reach full safe autonomy in the near future, and in doing so will begin to save more lives that Elon has taken with the DoE cuts. Instead I’ll probably get an XPeng – same vision only FSD approach.
Elon is still a damaged sociopath politically aligned with a fascist. That Trump is doing everything to stall the USA’s renewable energy transition is worse.
My FU to Elon will be to spend my Tesla profits paying for a trans loved one’s gender assigning care.
So basically your objection to Tesla is that Musk isn’t adhering to the Left’s position?
Plenty of others take the view that America’s debt has been spiralling for decades, and sped up under Biden. I don’t think I’ve seen any figures for Trump 2.0 so can’t say whether he’s managed to put reduce spending below Biden levels or not. But why should America be responsible for funding HIV and malaria care in Africa? There’s roughly 200 countries in the world, and Africa isn’t even the same hemisphere as Africa.
Fascist? No Musk supported Trump and the Constitution over Kamala and Walz. The fascists lost. Trump is committed to MAGA, which doesn’t include subsidising renewable energy, especially CCP efforts.
Likewise plenty have major ethical, medical, and scientific concerns regarding trans stuff so don’t want any of their money going that way!
Honestly given your choice of examples I’m wondering if you’re actually trolling.
Hi John,
Here are the core features of Trump fascism: authoritarian leadership claimed as the national will, with infallibility of the leader. Extreme populist nationalism that’s exclusionary, rooted in perceived national decline and humiliation, promoting “rebirth” and unity through superiority. Suppression of opposition through political violence and persecution of minorities. Use of scapegoats—immigrants, opponents, or marginalized groups—to unify followers. Militarism, glorification of violence, and contempt for democratic institutions and free press. Alliance between corporate elites and regime, suppression of labor, sexism, and rigid gender roles. Disdain for intellectuals and critical arts. Cronyism, corruption, and loyalty over competence. A cult of tradition and conspiracy, rejecting modernism while exploiting fear and social frustration to gain power. Ring any bells?
Do you mean “fascism” like censoring comments that are precisely true, but don’t meet your narratives?
With all due respect Anthony, you’re spewing party line – this alone probably means this post won’t get past the mod i.e. you. Sadly it also means SQ going political.
Trump is America’s democratically elected leader, that makes him the national will. Had Kamala & Walz been elected then they’d claim they & their agenda was the national will. Note they explicitly campaigned on the basis of opposition to the Constitution.
Yes Trump is populist, so what? Kamala & Walz were exclusionary, they just focused on different groups.
Not sure about the humiliation element, but America’s decline is a fairly common talking point.
Political violence by the Left against the Right is rising, including killings.
Legitimate concerns =/= scapegoats. You ignore the Left’s scapegoating – old\White\males\Conservatives\Christians\Republicans…
Depends on the institution as to Left or Right holds it in contempt e.g. SCOTUS. Free press has a major Left bias, or worse. Trust is thus low.
Hi John,
I have neither the time, the character limit, nor the crayons to explain but there’s a stark difference between “going political” & spelling out basic facts.
Trump leads the country which invented gerrymnander. Recently he’s said Biden planted the FBI to foment Jan6 riots when Trump himself was still in power, making the inflammatory comments to try and turn an election with violence. His flimsy lies are designed to create mistrust and support his cult of leadership.
The problem we have is polarisation, echo chambers & wealth inequality.
I’d suggest you read here for some balance from an acclaimed historian with a long term view.
Under Trump US life expectancy fell for the first time ever.
We don’t want populism here, it kills people.
According to Andrew’s crayons, Trump killed all these Americans, not Covid, despite twice as many dying under Biden. Note that life expectancy fell in Canada in 2020, 2021 and 2022, but relax, I’m sure Andrew won’t blame Justin Trudeau.
I’m sure the chart is just a bad joke trying to show people that correlation doesn’t equal causation.
(By the way, Andrew’s awesome crayons show a sharp drop in life expectancy under Carter just prior to 1980 and again under Clinton around 1993 … so much for “Under Trump US life expectancy fell for the first time ever”)
Hi Harry,
If you’re going to make personal attacks you could at least get the names right.
And realise the graph is about wealth inequality, it doesn’t cover covid.
Average Deaths/Week
Trump: ~8,359
Biden: ~3,940
The death rate under Biden was less than half that under Trump, although the absolute number is larger simply because Biden was managing the pandemic for much longer.
Vaccines became widely available under Biden, despite which many deaths occurred mainly in counties leaning heavily towards Trump, where vaccine uptake was significantly lower, resulting in substantially higher death rates in those areas.
We don’t need dumb populism, incompetent leadership and personality cults, they kill people.
Thanks again for proving it.
US life expectancy is significantly shorter because heathcare is expensive & inequality rife, so on average more poor people die.
Canada and the US are highly enmeshed, though the Canuks took a scientific approach, they were hamstrung while Trump was so erratic & uncoordinated. He interfered politically with the Centre for Disease Control, delayed proper public messaging and blocked PPE shipments.
The updated graph shows despite being similar first world island nations, Boris botched the UK compared to NZ & Aus.
Thankfully we had responsible state governments to step up, where Morrison was an abject failure at the federal responsibility of quarantine. The one boat he didn’t stop was a cruise ship full of covid.
Trump’s mismanagement and mixed messaging killed people.
Very much my own position, Finn. Business owners will not change unless their customers tell them in clear terms they need to, so not buying a Tesla sends that message. But I have a second rationale that has generally stood me well over the years. I often support the second best in any competition, particularly when it is an up-and-comer. They have to try harder to get to No 1; their margins are generally keener; and without effective competition the No 1 is a monopolist and rent extractor. So, overall, not buying a Tesla but one of their keen competitors is actually a very good thing from a broader economic and whole-of-society viewpoint. Now, can I stretch that logic to go with the Alfa Junior? Geeez, but of a stretch that, but…….
Finn Peacock: – “The revolution will happen. The tech is too good. But it’ll drag, slowed by the messiness of humans.”
Unfortunately, the Laws of Physics does not wait for us humans to get busy.
A 2017 research paper, reported by The Conversation, suggested that Sydney & Melbourne are on course for 50 °C summer days by the 2040s if high GHG emissions continue.
https://theconversation.com/the-reality-of-living-with-50-temperatures-in-our-major-cities-85315
The all-time max. temperature for Penrith was 48.9 °C, recorded on 4 Jan 2020. On that day, Penrith was the hottest place on Earth & set a new record for the Sydney basin.
Since 2017 paper was published the rate of GMST warming has accelerated to ~0.4 °C/decade most recently.
https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-6079807/v1
Thus, it seems to me 50 °C summer days may arrive sooner.
At 52 °C shaded dry bulb temperature with 15% relative humidity, at this condition, heat stroke is imminent.
Geoff, I find Paul Beckwith an easy way to be fed some of the latest climate papers. Today it was some research on falling albedo, which appears to be contributing to warming to an extent equivalent to 120 – 140 ppm CO₂. As that’s in a feedback loop, runaway to a new norm would appear to be accelerating, not just observably, but also through confirmed mechanisms.
I’ve had RELA look at the possibility of a few tens of MW of PV and matching MWh of gridscale batteries in the back paddock, but the cost a substation to tap into the passing 66 kV feeder made them turn their noses up. Being just outside a REZ doesn’t help, as those inside have to have first whack.
After going carbon negative, home & travel, it’s not that easy to foster a hellova lot more. But helping ICE cars off the road yesterday is the big win going wanting, I think.
1. Safe travels is a combination of driver, car and road. Modern cars are as safe as you can get, some drivers are bad, and most of the roads are bad.
Lets improve driving education and ask politicians to spend more of our taxes on improving our roads.
As the need to relax while traveling, you should get public transport or a taxi.
2. Home batteries dont stay idle, at least no more than the cars on our driveways. Should we share our cars too?
VPPs are not making money for battery owners, they are making money for the likes like Origin. It is just another business!
3. EVs would have existed without Elon.
Actually Elon did not invent anything!
He is just a good entrepreneur.
We should vote with our wallets who deserves to build our future. Yes, other EV car companies make huge profits but they dont back up toxic american politicians.
Erik Christiansen: – “But helping ICE cars off the road yesterday is the big win going wanting, I think.”
I think it’s also an energy security issue. Australia is reliant on about 93% petroleum-derived imports. It’s likely the two remaining Australian operating refineries may close soon.
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/battery-rebate-to-deliver-a-coal-plant-of-power-in-18-months/#comment-1728336
Meanwhile, disrupt Australia’s diesel fuel imports & our 2 refineries & we stop functioning in about a month.
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/ev-ruc-australia-mb3264/#comment-1727839
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/ev-ruc-australia-mb3264/#comment-1727842
If China attacks Taiwan, expect long fuel queues, fuel rationing, fuel hording and perhaps no fuel at all available, here in Australia, like what’s happening in Russia now.
https://youtu.be/c26dttCGYaQ?t=191
Geoff, and others appear to be saying that unless CO2 reductions are averted, a global agricultural crisis is risked. Can we afford a modern Ice Age?
If some countries focus on … maximising CO2 emissions to ensure maximum crop growth, and other nations seek to ban any and all non-Stone Age emissions, the world will be pulled in two directions at once, with neither side achieving their goals, but only one side suffering.
John Alba: – “Geoff, and others appear to be saying that unless CO2 reductions are averted, a global agricultural crisis is risked.”
Extreme weather, such as droughts, floods, & heatwaves, can damage or destroy crops, leading to lower yields. Some research suggests that changes in the jet stream could lead to simultaneous extreme weather events in multiple food-producing regions, risking “synchronised harvest failures”.
https://doi.org/10.1016/j.crm.2022.100473
John Alba: – “Can we afford a modern Ice Age?”
Professor H. J. Schellnhuber CBE, founder & Director Emeritus, Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research, said in Oct 2018:
“So, some people have speculated the next ice age will be next week. I can tell you: It’s not true! Don’t believe that! [audience chuckles] It will happen… I blow it up… Actually, never again!”
https://youtu.be/QK2XLeGmHtE?t=1256
Who to believe? John Alba, or climate scientist Prof Schellnhuber?
“All time record”
The Penrith weather station was opened in 1995.
Penrith Lakes AWS recorded 48.9 °C on the 4 Jan 2020, which broke the record for the highest temperature ever recorded in the Sydney basin (exceeding the previous record of 47.8 °C recorded at Richmond RAAF in 1939).
https://www.bom.gov.au/climate/current/month/nsw/archive/202001.sydney.shtml#recordsTmaxDailyHigh
RICHMOND RAAF (067033): Commenced: 1928; Status: Closed 31 Oct 1994
https://www.bom.gov.au/climate/averages/tables/cw_067033_All.shtml
RAAF Richmond (067105): The specific meteorological station at the RAAF base commenced operations in 1993.
https://www.bom.gov.au/climate/averages/tables/cw_067105_All.shtml
Nearby Richmond – UWS Hawkesbury (067021): A different, long-term weather station at UWS Hawkesbury, located in the same general area, started recording data in 1881.
https://www.bom.gov.au/climate/averages/tables/cw_067021.shtml
I’d reply again, but I believe the topic has moved over to politics and fascism. How appropriate.
Hi Harry,
As moderators, we sometimes get in trouble with the management for allowing the discourse to become “too political” but it’s difficult to avoid when the smell of Musk permeates the atmosphere.
As one wag put it, Elon Musk is today’s Henry Ford.
Musk himself called Ford a “next-level genius” for his industry-transforming innovations. The production line, doubling the working wage, hire purchase and low cost motoring for everyone was nothing short of revolutionary.
He had money to attrect the talent needed to invent the affordable V8, and build a B24 bomber every hour. Yet he used violence to suppress labour unions.
However Ford broadedned his impact beyond cars, dabbling in media with the Dearborn Independent, a bit like Musk has by buying twitter.
There’s a certain leader from 1930s Germany who really admired Ford and his newspaper.
Seems to some extent, Musk likes to emulate them both.
We should perhaps agree, despite genius, they’re all very flawed people.
Yeah, everyone that doesn’t agree with me is a Nazi. Luckily Chairman Xi is a top guy, just brimming with ideas about democracy and justice for all, that’s why there’s not a peep here about him.
The quote in context:
“And he talks about, you know, basically suicidal empathy. Mm. Like, if there’s, like, there’s so much empathy that you actually suicide yourself.
01:16:19
Yeah.
01:16:21
So that we’ve got civilizational suicidal empathy going on. And it’s like, I believe in empathy. Like, I think you should care about other people, but you need to have empathy for civilization as a Whole and not commit to a civilizational suicide.
01:16:34
Also, don’t let someone use your empathy against you so they can completely control your state and then do an insanely bad job of managing it and never get removed.
01:16:45
The fundamental weakness of Western civilization is empathy. The empathy exploit. They’re exploiting a bug in Western civilization.”
Somehow I still expect you are proud of yourself.
Hi Harry,
I don’t know if you noticed but Jane Goodall recently died and nobody has had to put any context around the things she famously said.
“This planet has finite natural resources. And in some places, we’ve used them up faster than Mother Nature can replenish them. How can it make sense if we carry on in the way we are now, with business as usual, to have unlimited economic development on a planet with finite natural resources, and a growing population?”
If you want to talk about civilisational suicide, then we should be making the planet we already inhabit hospitable, instead of terraforming Mars.
Yeah sure:
“ CLAIM: Conservationist Jane Goodall said: “We can solve all the world’s problems if we reduce the world population to where it was 500 years ago,” at a World Economic Forum conference.
AP’S ASSESSMENT: Missing context. This misrepresents Goodall’s remarks and is not a real quote. While she did say many of the world’s environmental problems would be relieved if the population was that of 500 years ago, she did not advocate for depopulation efforts”
I see my original response to the “record temperatures” and siting is still censored.
Hi Harry,
I’m going to have to fire up the baler to deal with the size of this strawman.
There’s more than a few moderators so maybe another of the team is growing disinterested with incessant science denial.
We’ve know what’s going for well more than 60 years. This program is 5 decades old and raises the issues, so I’d encourage you to listen to the whole thing, and get back to us with your thoughts about the content from around 9 minutes onward.
https://www.abc.net.au/listen/programs/scienceshow/the-science-show-celebrates-50-years/105658842
Harry (at October 13, 2025 at 7:56 pm): – “I’d reply again, but I believe the topic has moved over to politics and fascism. How appropriate.”
Um, I’m puzzled how my more fulsome presentation of relevant weather stations in the Sydney basin, in response to your earlier comment about an “All time record,” can be perceived in any way as having “moved over to politics and fascism.” Please explain?
Are my factual & context relevant responses inconvenient for your ideological narratives, Harry?
[edited to remove misnaming and personal attacks]
Hi Geoff,
Specifically to your points:
The Penrith AWS site is 16km away from the Richmond RAAF base.
It would be foolish to think they will produce directly comparable results.
A new station was opened in 1993 at the RAAF base. On 4 Jan 2020 the temp recorded was 47.4ºC just short of the prior record. It is much more likely to be comparable.
The production of the other sites’ history doesn’t change the fact that all that the short term Penrith record likely indicates is that for at least some weather, the site is warmer than the Richmond site 16km away.
Microclimates are real.
Harry (at October 14, 2025 at 3:57 pm): – “The Penrith AWS site is 16km away from the Richmond RAAF base.”
On 4 Jan 2020:
Penrith Lakes AWS reached 48.9 °C
Richmond reached 47.4 °C (-1.5 °C relative to Penrith Lakes AWS)
Badgerys Creek AWS 47.6 °C (-1.3 °C relative to Penrith Lakes AWS)
https://www.bom.gov.au/climate/current/month/nsw/archive/202001.sydney.shtml#recordsTmaxDailyHigh
Harry (at October 14, 2025 at 3:57 pm): – “It would be foolish to think they will produce directly comparable results.”
And yet the evidence suggests temperatures are highly correlating. Penrith Lakes AWS and Richmond RAAF both have warmest days on average at 32.5 °C.
Penrith Lakes AWS has been operating for 30 years, and is demonstrating temperatures are highly correlating with Richmond RAAF and the much longer running Richmond – UWS Hawkesbury (067021).
Being a retired power industry engineer I have been a little slow getting on board with renewable energy but now well and truly there. I live in Tasmania when most of our electrify is already renewable but 15 years ago I did my initial little bit. Changed my hot water to direct solar and installed a 2.5kW solar system. I have a wood heater and 4 individual reverse cycle heat pump to heat and occasional cool my house.
8 months again I decided to get a bit more real so added an additional 8kW of solar and was considering a battery in the near future. Then my main car was written off in an accident so a replacement just had to be a “battery”. An MG ZSEV. Being an uber driver working early morning it was clear my EV charging was going to be solar. I decided. To stick with my old 93/94 tariff as my hot water and heating are already mostly renewable. Proving to be spot on and now setting my Catch Control to optimise even more as the summer
Patrick, like you, I’m a Tasmanian and installed a 19kW solar system on a large, unshaded flat roof. Have not paid a power bill since, and we take a holiday each year on the returns from the feed-in tariff. Because Tasmania can keep filling its hydro lakes (Gordon and Great Lake for the most part) for a very, very long time there is no need to reduce the feed-in tariff. Every kW not consumed is a kW that can be stored and sent back to grid in times of high demand. And, of course, if we send it to Victoria we are reducing the call in Victoria of the most polluting power in the country – brown coal.
I’ve been an avid advocate of Elon for honks and have read both Vance’s and Issacson’s bio’s on the man.
There is the old ethos “ends justify the means” and we see that, if we care to look at every influence of our lives, who is selling what and how?.
Is ethics a reality when we are the commodity being used and our vital essence is being squeezed and used for the benefit of others?
We are enraged when people we disagree with become successful and untouchable by the cancel culture community.
We applaud the battlers that struggle hard fought wins at every juncture in their journey.
Elon is both those people wrapped in one, we have managed to pivot our meagre achievements to align with with his overwhelming vision and in the same nonsensical “logic” condemn him as a “nazi” for doing what he does.
Elon’s direction has not altered, his self imposed mandate is to save the collective human intelligence from the “nonsensical stupidity of the masses.
Elon used to be a Democrat who stated Tesla’s mission was to “advance sustainable transport and energy”. Saying he hasn’t changed when he’s politically aligned with a fascist hell bent on stopping the renewable energy transition means your statement Elon hasn’t changed is an “alternative fact” – in other words – “Total BS”.
I have decided to focus in on the product itself, rather than being emotional about a purchase like a car. The main thing is that there are no other car manufacturers that come close to what Tesla has done with Full Self Driving Supervised (and kinda unsupervised in the current RoboTaxi fleet in USA). Tesla is so far ahead. Just look at the data centre with immense compute power Tesla has to train the data, plus the 5 million fleets of Tesla vehicles around the world that is sending data for training.
I choose to respect and appreciate all the people who have engineered and designed everything at Tesla instead.
Not only are Tesla vehicles cheap to run, the Tesla API catalogue and commands that can be sent remotely, allows tech savvy enthusiasts to further automate EV charging with the house’s setup, plus more fun automation scenarios. Sure, you can do the same with some other vehicle manufacturers, but Tesla is the CHEAPEST and flexible in this setup.
I don’t think people eschew VPPs because they “hate big energy”; they are simply not good value at best and snake oil at worst. If Origin or AGL or whoever came up with an improvement on Amber, people wouldn’t care who owned it (just like I am unphased by Origin owning SQ).
With solar and a decent battery (>16kWh), you are free of being an obligate energy consumer because you are 100% shielded from wholesale spikes. What you need from a retailer then is just a relatively simple software service to mediate access to the grid / market for your net evening exporting and occasional cheap daytime imports. Which should return a profit, not just lower bills.
Last night in NSW (with Amber) I made $23 in an unusually high evening spike. A Big Energy VPP would have pocketed that, not mentioned the event, and told you how lucky you are to have zero bills.
I reckon Big Energy VPPs have about the same prospects we are now seeing in hydrogen – the idea seems great until rubber hits the road.
I have joined BatteryEase VPP at Energy Australia. Extremely simple and you maintain control of your battery. The amount they take is very minimal (see the contract), and you can opt out anytime. I am focussed on self consumption, rather than making a small amount of money. Provided what I make outweighs what I import from the grid (winter being the issue), I’ll be happy. Everyone has different motives.
The VPP comments hit home, i have 24kwh battery and i won’t join a vpp. I use Home Assistant to automate my setup so that i export to grid whenever the spot wholesale price i recieve is >1c per kWh while PV is producing and when >30c per kWh when it comes from battery. That means at the moment despite being 100% self sufficient i still.pay circa $60 a month to be part of the grid in service charges etc. Maybe in summer and winter it might be closer to $0 as unexpected bad stuff happens with the steam driven generators…but to be honest as more and more get batterys the volatility will fade away i think. The stupidity is that those who oppose renewables always say that the sun doesn’t always shine and the wind doesn’t always blow…get enough.of us wirh batterys and that will be 100% wrong. The sun always shines somewhere and the wind always blows somewhere..especially if there’s renewables dinosaurs espousing their theory’s….plenty of hot windy air then!!
Great to know the sun always shines somewhere. What’s your plans for shipping the sun from Africa to Australia?
Batteries are great until you factor in their price per kWh over their lifetime.
Alternatively you could prepay your energy bill by $25k and celebrate not having to pay electricity bills for a decade. By the way I’ve bought 2x48kWh because I like expensive toys. Should be a fun optimisation problem.
I’m another who probably won’t buy another Tesla:
1. I don’t want my money going to Elon’s absurdly excessive bonuses.
2. I don’t want my money funding the extremist Republican Party.
3. I dislike the increasingly minimalist approach which requires more and more screen interactions (gear selection, cruise control/autosteer option selection, lights etc), and a voice recognition command alternative that almost never understands what I say.
4. So many competitors that offer so much more (true 3D cameras, heads up display, driver console, stalk controls for wipers, headlights etc).
5. I’ve no desire to pay over $10,000 for FSD that still requires 100% supervision. It’s just something cool for tech geeks. If you are looking forward to unsupervised FSD you probably shouldn’t have a driver’s license.
Tesla haven’t innovated much since I bought mine in 2021. They’ve just made driving their cars more difficult and are now focused on robots and robotaxis.
i see your point of view, but even if Tesdla wasnt run by Elon Musk, i would be buying from the opposition (waymo) who have had self drive taxi’s working well on the roads for quite a while now, so their systems actually work – Unlike all the promises and bluster coming from Tesla, who seem to be defending a lot of law suites because, well, their systems dont work as promised.
Waymo doesn’t sell cars and has no plans to sell cars. I personally prefer the LIDAR approach but it imposes a cost in both hardware, computational load and a bump on the roof of the car. Apparently it can also blast some pixels from the CCD in the digital camera on your phone if you happen to point it at the car at the wrong time.
Hi Harry,
You’re up to about 7 comments in a row now, none of them very genial or helpful.
I’ve tried in good faith to explain polarisation drives poor outcomes & this thread is proof positive.
Debunking unsubstantiated arsertions requires time, during which you claim to be censored just because the moderation isn’t fast enough. It’s not rational.
Your language shows you’ve not appreciated being a guest here, nor the work we do trying to help people.
Screeching censorship becomes self fulfilling if you can’t say anything nice, but you’re welcome to say it outside the airlock.
Good bye
Its only a car…Without Elon no EV industry. Try checking out the Oil & Gas industry FUD
Regarding VPP’s, the NSW government is already “intending to review” reducing the PDRS target for the BESS 2 VPP incentives. Do you know what this means, practically speaking, in terms of VPP incentive value.
“We therefore intend to review the 2026-27 Peak Demand Reduction Scheme target and consider reducing the target ahead of the 31 October 2025 deadline. Any target reduction will be made only where necessary to reduce the risk that Scheme participants pay penalties.”
https://www.energy.nsw.gov.au/nsw-plans-and-progress/regulation-and-policy/energy-security-safeguard/peak-demand-reduction-scheme
Yes, well it is slowly dawning on those who bought EV’s that they cannot save the world. Not even make a difference, because of the cost to the planet to make the bloody things, then to dispose of them.
If you purchased an AUS$ 80 k Tesla here in Australia one year ago, it would be a stroke of good fortune if you sold it for AUS$ 40 k today. That’s if you can find a buyer.
Wow, you are really stirring the pot with this one, Finn. Carnage. Bloody roads! Millions will die!! Elon Musk… is he the Messiah, or just a naughty boy?
I suspect that Tesla drivers would already be among the safest drivers on the roads, even before they bought a Tesla. If you really want to address the road toll then your revolution will need to bring in enforced Tesla ownership for 19-year-old petrol heads. And they will have to be locked onto FSD so they can never exceed the speed limit. But that may result in a counter-revolution.
One thing that doesn’t seem to occur to FSD-enthusiasts is that a lot of people actually enjoy driving a car. I know I do. I like the control, and the decision-making and reacting to different scenarios. I’ve always preferred manual cars over automatic. I have zero interest in FSDs.
If I want to have a relaxing trip looking out the window, I will take a train.
“I suspect that Tesla drivers would already be among the safest drivers on the roads”
Not according to Insurance firms
https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevebanker/2025/02/11/tesla-again-has-the-highest-accident-rate-of-any-auto-brand/
Source: https://www.lendingtree.com/insurance/brand-incidents-study/
Ah, interesting. So, buying a Tesla has made them into a worse driver!
Thinking that FSD will somehow save “millions of lives” is a Utopian fantasy.
yeah…it seems that through out the ages of time early adopters of new tech were more at risk than those that followed…. the first aviators had a ball right up until they died in a steep dive into terra(or) firma and those participating in aviation today expect to arrive safely as they step off their A380…. who would of though it!!!
Like then, when we historically correctly accepted that it’ll get better in the aviation world, I personally have every expectation that it will also be the case for FSD… I expect that the term “utopian fantasy” probably wont be in widespread use when refering to FSD, except amongst Luddites, when the tech matures…..
Ah, good comparison example. Thanks, Andy.
Early aviators were aware they were guinea pigs and they accepted the risks and the possibility of accidents. They were experimenting in empty skies and if they did end up doing a steep dive into terra firma they were very unlikely to take out any innocent bystanders in the process.
FSD car drivers, on the other hand, are being sold the idea that it is “99% there” (despite a recent Aust journalist’s video showing it can’t see potholes, it went around a traffic island on the wrong side of the road and it slowed to a crawl on the entrance ramp to a freeway). So, drivers are not only being used as guinea pigs in a huge Elon Musk experiment, but it is being conducted on public roads and all other road users are forced to take part.
I can see FSD planes will become a thing, as the sky and airports are a controlled and manageable environment. But roads… no. They are just barely organised chaos. If that makes me a Luddite, well, so be it.
While the logic v emotion point is correct, I think the examples are poor.
Opposition to CCP panels is not due to emotion, rather it’s logic based opposition to the CCP and what it stands for. Consider it a micro scale Boycott, Divestment, and Sanctions against a country with a horrific record on human rights, the environment, military aggression against neighbours etc.
As for rejecting a VPP, is that because folk hate Big Energy, or simply because they don’t like the VPP concept? I have absolutely nothing against Origin myself, but I’m not keen on the VPP concept. Why? Because it’s loss of control. Bear in mind I’m not really familiar with the concept, but as I understand it “they” decide when to drain your battery so if you’re relying on it for overnight power, or a looming blackout, you may very well discover your battery is flat, or nearly so, just when you need it. That’s you subsidising the grid, not protecting your own power needs. Given the poor RoI, that’s a terrible idea!!!
John Alba: – “Opposition to CCP panels is not due to emotion, rather it’s logic based opposition to the CCP and what it stands for.”
I’d suggest China is taking multiple steps to reduce its reliance on foreign energy imports, including rapid expansion of its clean energy sector like solar and wind, which are becoming a larger share of its energy mix.
EV sales in China just hit a historic milestone — surpassing 1.3 million units in a single month and capturing a record 59% market share!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OupCNE9IUs
China is diversifying its energy supply chains to reduce geopolitical risks, which can be a concern with oil & gas routes that pass through politically unstable regions or narrow waterways.
Meanwhile, Australia is currently reliant on 93% petroleum-derived imports, which I think is an increasingly precarious energy security issue.
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/future-built-by-people-you-dont-like/#comment-1728718
No, CCP China is seeking to reduce its economic and military dependency on foreign nations it doesn’t control e.g. Australia. Even if you were to assert that the CCP’s embrace of renewable energy is purely selfless and right thinking policy, that doesn’t address the issue of ” human rights, the environment, military aggression against neighbours etc” unless you don’t think those are matters that count?
I’m not quite sure what your point is in regards to CCP citizens moving to battery powered rather than ICEV cars.
Yes the CCP is seeking to reduce its military and economic vulnerabilities whilst weaponising its control of resources against other countries e.g. rare earths. Your point?
God willing the CCP never pulls the trigger on Taiwan as that will domino a lot of issues, fuel not being the primary one unless WW3 breaks out. Yes Australia relies on imported fuel, but relying on CCP infrastructure to replace it seems risky!!! There is no simply solution.
John Alba: – “God willing the CCP never pulls the trigger on Taiwan as that will domino a lot of issues, fuel not being the primary one…”
Hope is not a solution. Diesel fuel is the premier energy resource.
Without an adequate supply of diesel fuel, then Australia stops functioning in less than a month. Without diesel fuels there are no deliveries of petrol, jet, & LPG fuels via ships & trucks. Diesel fuels are essential for heavy transport, agriculture, construction, mining (including coal and gas extraction), keeping factories producing & keeping people fed & healthy.
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/ev-ruc-australia-mb3264/#comment-1727842
Distribution of food, water and medicine ‘would stop within days’.
If you had a major interruption of fuel input, defence would grind to a halt very quickly because you can’t do anything.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-02-24/fuel-imports-a-risk-amid-south-china-sea-tensions-nrma-advisor/7149648
As regards that 93% petroleum derived imports, according to https://oec.world/en/profile/country/aus?yearlyTradeFlowSelector=flow1&selector343id=Import 2023 data shows 29.9% of refined petroleum came from South Korea, 22.2% from Singapore, 14.7% from Malaysia, 9.64% from India, 7.09% from Taiwan. Not all comes from Asia, but 99.7% does.
Reducing Australia’s dependency on foreign imports, and its just in time fuel delivery approach, would be a good thing, but both approaches would cost money and neither government nor private business want to pay that price, so until disaster happens, nothing is likely to change.
John Alba: – “Not all comes from Asia, but 99.7% does.”
Diesel is the critical transport fuel.
See the Average Monthly Diesel imports to Australia, between May 2024 – Apr 2025 at:
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/ev-ruc-australia-mb3264/#comment-1727839
John Alba: – “Reducing Australia’s dependency on foreign imports, and its just in time fuel delivery approach, would be a good thing, but both approaches would cost money…”
What price do you put on having the ‘lights on’, food on your table, and a supply of medicines to maintain your health?
John Alba: – “…neither government nor private business want to pay that price, so until disaster happens, nothing is likely to change.”
That’s the proverbial ostrich in the sand approach. If disaster happens then that’s all far too late then to bring us back from the brink of catastrophe, aye John?
Geoff, are you accusing me of being the ostrich, or corporations, or government? America has national security regulations which apply, or get applied, to certain industries. Australia either doesn’t have anything similar, or the politicians aren’t applying them. Australia could be made self sufficient, but it’s considered a price not worth paying. That leaves us with the 不好意思 我不懂中文. option – assuming SQ’s site can handle non-English ‘letters’.
The current cost of living crisis is such that people are looking to see where they can spend less, not how they can spend more. That being said, what would the per litre cost to fuel be, or government subsidy be, for building, expanding, and\or reopening, and running refineries to provide at least half Australia’s fuel requirements? This of course assumes government doesn’t own and operate the refineries itself as a public utility akin to water, power, telecommunications, or rail. Of course given privatisation …
We have solar panels on our house. We have a smart meter. The question I ask is – ‘ can smart meters be manipulated by energy providers to their advantage?’. I am with Origin
Yes of course.
Demand pricing structures are their worst weapon.
But charging people excessive power costs during peak times when they have to use power in an evening is their main weapon of choice.
Not an honest one amongst them. Thieves.
I used to think that until I got onto the wholesale market and saw who was actually levying the costs.
Its often spoken of that in the middle of the day prices for wholesale electricity are negative. I can assure that is true, but only half the story.
I’m in an essential energy distribution area and when those prices are negative during the day essential energy happily slugs both their TOU carriage fee (which I think varies depending on which TOU window your in) and also their daily service fee on top of the generators negative price. The federal government is taking their chunk of certificate and environmental levies out and then there is your retailers profit margin/service charge. The negative prices (often touted at -2 or -3c per kwh) will actually cost you 13 to 17 c per kwh by the time the DNSP/Gov gets their chuck of your $. I personally believe that the DNSP percentage of the price you pay is where we should be looking more closely…there isn’t much scrutiny around them
Only if demand pricing is applied. If you’re on a flat rate plan, what’s to manipulate?
for quite a while, when you got a nice shiny new smart meter, you got a time of use (if you were lucky) plan no questions asked, if you were unlucky, a demand plan.
I was lucky, they had changed the rules by the time my smart meter went in so i was able to stay on a flat rate, many before me didn’t get the choice.
See I’ve never had a time of use plan, but when I shopped around for best power plans, one company insisted I was in a time of use area and so only offered a demand deal. Naturally I did NOT go with them. Ultimately I’ve been a ‘loyal’ customer and stuck with my original supplier – they offered the best (custom) deal. As to how long I’ll be able to stay on said plan, that I don’t know.
Couple of points not mentioned in this article:
#1 For many people EVs aren’t all about FSD, it’s about cheaper options, less maintenance and V2G etc, I think FSD has become a low priority for many prospective EV buyers.
#2 Your article suggests FSD is perfect, even though it’s maybe safer than a human (although Elons media promises are a known joke), we know it has been responsible for deaths in the US. I think for a rounded article you should have mentioned, no matter how small, the risks of FSD too.
I think that factually speaking your points are valid, but at the same time its not really necessary to mention the FSD risks because unless you live under a rock with no media exposure any accident in a FSD scenario is broadcast in “terminator” style dread of FSD/AI capabilities by any and all mainstream media…. and might I say that when ever that occurs they never mention that ….in other news today 5 other Australian drivers of traditional ICE cars were killed and 110 others hospitalised in technically avoidable, but practically unavoidable road accidents. This is 1 more fatality than in a “normal day” and exactly as expected for hopitalisation..
I look at this long row of posts, and I realise of how naive they are…
Talking about buying Chinese stuff… we all have the majority of our goods made in China including solar panels, inverters and batteries but still blaming China for human rights abuses? Give me a break… is Australia better? Is America better? Who is better? Who started most of the big wars? Europe, America or China?
Who is the most belligerant country in the world? America or China?
Common guys read some history!
Self driving cars? An utopia, on Australian roads Finn!
Self driving cars need to read the linemarking, signage and guess the drivers behaviour. Good luck with that on 90% on Aussie roads!
Don’t like driving? Get a cab.
Blaming ICE cars for pollution? Good but not enough!
The biggest polluter is the Aussie coal, burnt locally and overseas. Buying an EV is not enough, get off coal and talk after.
Are you ready to give up your dirty energy air conditioner and spend money on trully insulating your house?
Hi Alex,
It’s curious isn’t it, you could go to Bunnos on the weekend and get your snags and bread, but without China there would be no tongs to serve them and the joint would be largely empty. Maybe plants, pine posts and no shelves to put them on?
People exclaim about the pollution in China, saying that we should burn our own coal, without acknowledging the pollution in China is ours. Not only are we exporting the raw materials, we are demanding the shiny new landfill shipped back to stock the hardware shop.
Fact is that 20 years ago China saw the future and decided they would own renewables. Now they make 90% of solar PV and have installed more than the rest of the world has. Pretty soon they won’t need our coal.
A billion Chinese are being freed from poverty at record pace, while “freedom” in the US means gaoling it’s own at triple the rate China does.
Respectfully Anthony, you’re pushing partisan CCP viewpoints again. Yes the official Chinese incarceration rate is lower than the US, but that’s because pre-trial detainees, those in administrative detention, those in Xinjiang’s concentration camps aka ‘vocational education and training centres’ etc, aren’t counted in official figures – and that’s assuming the official incarceration figures are accurate. Given China also claims to have some of the lowest COVID fatality rates, despite being ground zero, it’s fair to have scepticism about their claims!!!
Say rather China saw an opportunity to make a buck and ran with it. Yes, current figures have China at over 39% of global solar generation, they also generate about a third of global power. America has been somewhat stagnant for the last couple of decades, whereas China’s has quadrupled.
China’s Australian coal imports are less than half the value they used to be, but only ~2% of exports come this way. Japan and India buy a lot more
Hi Anthony,
It is curious how people are blind to these facts. Maybe is the mainstream media who tells them that China is the enemy and America the friend?
My opinion is that is the other way around.
Last big change of “world sherrifs” was friendly because both were speaking English, and British saw in Americans a kind of continuation of their empire.
Now that the “upcoming sheriff” is speaking Chinese, makes people nervous!
The change is happening folks, because empires fall from within when they get fat and full of themselves.
Alex,
It has never been mentioned in this discourse the fact that 10 times as many people die of the cold than die of the heat throughout the world.
Also is anyone aware of the political mindsets of the bosses of BYD, Polestar, VW, Porsche etc. etc.?
Mr. Musk has opinions that are controversial to say the least but to say that we should not “buy a car” from him sounds like an idiotic conclusion to me.
Wow so much irrational hate for Teslas just because their CEO is a flake! Like all the EV haters because majority of EVs are from China.
When I look at purchasing a motor vehicle I look at the pros and cons of the vehicle, not whether the manufacturer’s CEO is a nutbag or it’smade in China. If the car suits my needs, within my budget and has parts and service back up then I will buy it. What the CEO does in his spare time doesn’t interest (or effect) me in the slightest.
I agree with Ronald Brakels summary of Tesla’s FSD (disclaimer: I haven’t driven or even been in a Tesla with FSD). So far this year the road toll (deaths – not including injuries) is up over 230, up nearly 10% from 2024. Yet cars these days have a plethora of driving aids such as ABS brakes, lane departure warning, airbags etc etc, but somehow the cars are still crashing and people are still dying. My experience as both a driver and cyclist of 45 years is that people’s driving behaviour/skill level is getting worse.
Ross,
I suppose you are being here because you care about the climate change or at least about the air you breathe in your city.
Now, you have Elon who makes EVs (👍) and the same Elon who paid millions to his buddy Trump to be elected, so he can “drill, baby drill” (👎 👎 👎).
What is so hard to understand?
We have plenty of EVs to choose from, if everything equal, why choose a Tesla?
But, of you really want a Tesla, nobody’s going to stop you, but don’t be surprised if someone, one day, will call you hypocrite!
Geoff,
Heat must be kept outside in summer and inside in winter, but Australian housed are just glorious tents, that suck huge amounts of energy to do what pasive design, proper insulation and double glazing should do.
Why we have this situation? I don’t know, but I can speculate.
Elon paid millions to his buddy Trump, to be elected. As far as I know, the other CEOs you mention, didn’t.
The irony is that Trump stands for what Elon is against, however Elon paid him anyway!
In the past houses burned kerosene for heating, hence the design rules included vents in every living area and required the air to be turned over around 8 times a day. My daughter’s council wouldn’t allow her to change her bathroom window due to heritage orders. Not only was it clearly a junk window from the 1960s (the house was originally part of a larger estate from the late 1800s) based on the wood used, but who the hell cares about a small bathroom window at the rear of a house 50 metres from the road with no prospect of it ever being on public view.
Best of luck getting council to approve proper double glazing,
Harry,
I double glazed my entire house without any issues from the local council.
It is true that my house is not heritage listed, but living in a heritage listed house is people’s choice and they have to live with that.
However, this is a very small procent of houses and it doesn’t change what I said.
Yeah, I’m looking to “retro fit” a second panel of glass on the inside with an air gap. Won’t be as effective as real double glazing but apparently provides a large percentage of the benefits. Leadlight windows are pretty but impractical, the glass is thinner, gaps right through the lead etc.
While it’s true that living in a heritage home is a choice, me not living here doesn’t suddenly remove the home from the housing stock, so someone has to deal with it.
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/stop-winter-entering-windows/